2020-2021 Hot Stove Thread

[IStillLoveTheMs]

1. Both LeMahiue and Brantley are in the back end of their primes. They'll go to teams who present them the opportunity to win right now. The M's, while they're set up for the future, are not yet enticing to free agents who are at the same stage in their careers as these two. The Yankees on the other hand, have a boat load of money, are in a position to win now, and LeMahiue fills a clear near. Honestly, I would be surprised if Brantley doesn't go to a team like the Cubs, Braves, Padres, Dodgers, White Sox, Twins... I see Brantley as a road block to this year's roster too... they're rolling with Haniger, obviously... if they sign Brantley and move him to DH, what would they do with France?

I think fans get WAY too caught up it the "chance to win" as the end all be all for FAs. That is ALL fans care about (there isn't any money involved for them) so they think players MUST feel the same way. And of course players are going to say it publically to appear like some selfless teammate that only cares about winning. While it may actually matter to some, for most it just comes down to the almighty dollar. Cano is example A, B and C.

And besides, look at the Angels and the Padres this season. Rendon signs with the Angels and they have a .433 record and never sniff the playoffs. Could have signed the White Sox and led them to the WS. If we sign Bauer and Hand why wouldn't Brantley follow. We could easily go deep in the playoffs with that team. Chicken or the egg.

For the third time, this is why Brantley is not a road block.

Yes, that is why Brantley is so perfect. He wouldn't be blocking anyone. Even if Haniger is healthy and productive from day one, Brantley can be moved from LF to DH when JK comes up. I imagine they will want to give Haniger plenty of days off and DH rest as well so it wouldn't be like he would be stuck at DH. France then go to UT until 2022 when he becomes 3B.

2. No. The M's will be in a position to sign a 33-year-old veteran (position player... can't emphasize this enough, pitchers are different) when it's clear that they're in the window to compete. I doubt you could convince any 33 year old that the 2021 M's is their shot to win ball games. That's why I said... if you sign any position player right now it better be some 26-27 year just coming out of their arbitration years who is part of the long-term compete window and you can sell them on that... I'm looking at 2022 for this assuming the M's don't make blockbuster trade because there's some serious studs who fit this description (Lindor, Baez, Rizzo, Bryant, Correa, Seager, Story). I propose the Lindor trade because it forces a superstar to us instead of relying on our shoddy chances in free agency is 2021 goes poorly - even though it was a free agent signing, it's similar to what the Padres did with Machado.

3. The M's are in a weird position where the bulk of their position players are young and MLB ready. Shortstop and catcher are the only 2 positions where I wouldn't be perplexed if they went out and sign somebody because JP sucks and I'm not sure our current catchers are part of the longterm plan. In the OF... Kyle Lewis and Jarred Kelenic have to be penned as starters for the next bulk of years... Julio is on the horizon and I'd just prefer the M's roll with Haniger until Julio is ready. + they have Trammel too... signing an OF just isn't in the cards IMO.

The reason you sign LeMahieu now is he can play anywhere on the field so he is not blocking anyone. You need to ease Moore into 2nd?? you split time there. White faltering at 1b? Play him there. Need to give Seager a day off? Play him there. When Seager moves on, you play him there. You just keep his bat in the lineup because his glove plays anywhere. It his leadership, attention to detail, and his ability to grind that needs to be shown to the rookies. We are in dire need of someone who is more interested in a hit and baserunner than swinging for a home run every damn time so you strike out 190 times a year.

In no way do I think LeMaheiu would not be a positive addition to this club.

He's just not going to sign here. The fit isn't there.

[D-train]

Why couldn't he be the full time 2B with Moore at SS? Could move to 1B if White can't figure it out.

[bpj]

Why couldn't he be the full time 2B with Moore at SS? Could move to 1B if White can't figure it out.

Now there's a bold play out of the offense-first playbook that I could get behind.

Just like putting Kyle Lewis in CF instead of a corner.

Take the offensive advantage where a guy gets 5 chances per game to make a difference compared to the one extra hard play every three games a great defender makes.

When you think of a full season of offense from Moore compared to Crawford would generate more offensive runs than Crawford over Moore at SS would save defensively.

That is of course if Moore and Crawfords production remained constant which isn't as certain, but the possibility should be on the table at least.

[D-train]

Why couldn't he be the full time 2B with Moore at SS? Could move to 1B if White can't figure it out.

Now there's a bold play out of the offense-first playbook that I could get behind.

Just like putting Kyle Lewis in CF instead of a corner.

Take the offensive advantage where a guy gets 5 chances per game to make a difference compared to the one extra hard play every three games a great defender makes.

When you think of a full season of offense from Moore compared to Crawford would generate more offensive runs than Crawford over Moore at SS would save defensively.

That is of course if Moore and Crawfords production remained constant which isn't as certain, but the possibility should be on the table at least.

Yep, if they were ok with former Catcher Long at 2B they should be fine with Moore at SS. btw how about converting Long back into a C where his bat has a chance to play.

[AT Funchal-Madeira]

Certainly not ready to give up on Crawford, his defense is top 5 and he shows promise with the bat. As for catching, Torrens shows potential, Murphy will be back and Raleigh hit 29 home runs in 2019 across several levels.. I'd keep my options open for a guy like Brantley, LeMahuie, Gregorious.... but I don't see them as essential... we could contend, but we are still more in the "evaluate and develop what we have mode" than in the "ready to contend mode"....Whoever we bring in should provide production along with veteran leadership.... Gordon provided leadership but no production.... we don't need anymore of that.

We need to show patience and give these kids a chance to develop and adjust.... Kelemic, Rodriguez, Lewis, look to be foundations for the future of the franchise and so far two thirds of that foundation haven't seen a major league pitch in a major league game. Sheffield, Gilbert, and Hancock look to be foundations for the starting roster and so far two thirds of that foudation haven't thrown from a major league mound.

Let's relax and enjoy the journey, and get to these critical "free agent" discussions next year. We are getting the cart in fromt of the horse right now, IMO.

[bpj]

Great points Terry. I think the difference is how a fan views contending.

To me it doesn't so much mean we have a clear-cut shot at winning the World Series. I would set the bar at simply making the playoffs for a young team like this.

They don't have to do much to give this team a chance at making the playoffs and still not waste money or squander opportunities for advancement. Just need (and deserve) more than they did to try and win last season.

[AT Funchal-Madeira]

Great points Terry. I think the difference is how a fan views contending.

To me it doesn't so much mean we have a clear-cut shot at winning the World Series. I would set the bar at simply making the playoffs for a young team like this. Going for it doesn't have to mean World Series or bust.

They don't have to do much to give this team a chance at making the playoffs and still not waste money or squander opportunities for advancement. Just need (and deserve) more than they did to try and win last season.

I can see that and..... being in a playoff is a learning experience for these young players also that could be valuable.... just don't want to blow the payroll out of the water with a $200 million dollar signing, and send off a bunch of prospects in a desperate attempt to be in a playoff game next season...

[Coeurd’Alene J]

Why do we have to go for it next year. We will not be ready, far to many rookies to season, What we need is a capable field manager to get these youngsters ready, The team has spoken and they have no intention to replace servix next yr. let’s play it out, send Kyle away either during the winter or at the end of next yr...could care less when. We have a volley of talent coming...let’s get ready to compete in 2 years and have a great shot for the next 5 to 6 yrs after that. I see little reason to spend this winter on what’s out there....We will obviously need an Ace or two, if we spend anything it should be on an Ace next offseason

[D-train]

Great points Terry. I think the difference is how a fan views contending.

To me it doesn't so much mean we have a clear-cut shot at winning the World Series. I would set the bar at simply making the playoffs for a young team like this.

They don't have to do much to give this team a chance at making the playoffs and still not waste money or squander opportunities for advancement. Just need (and deserve) more than they did to try and win last season.

Exactly!!!

[bpj]

They don't have to go for it.

But, they finished the season on a roll, the kids who have shown they belong will get roster spots.

It won't take much to "go for it" besides getting out of the way of their success. Stop putting losers on the team and these players will win.

But there are an obvious 3 or 4 holes so the only question is what type of player will they fill the spots with?

Braden Bishop and Shed Long? Or Michael Brantley and Trevor Bauer type players?

They don't have to break the bank to improve the team.

The real question is what's the point of not adding quality players to fill obvious holes? To save their short term cash? Not this guy.

If you're going to fix a leak, fix it, don't just wrap tape around it.