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Tariffs?
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 6:33 pm
by Michael K.
Someone smarter than me is going to have to explain the outrage. I mean, I just found this.
Before President Trump took office, what tariffs did Canada impose on U.S. goods, and what percentages were there on various products exported to the US?
Before January 1st, Canada had tariffs on certain U.S. products, primarily in sectors protected under its supply management system. These included:
Dairy Products: Tariffs ranged from 200% to 300% on items like milk, cheese, and butter to protect Canadian dairy farmers.
Poultry and Eggs: Similar high tariffs were applied to chicken, turkey, and eggs.
Grain Products: Some grains faced tariffs, though these were generally lower than those on dairy and poultry.
So, Canada charges the shit out of us, 200 to 300%....but we are the devil now that we are going to add tariffs? What am I missing here?
https://thefulcrum.us/business-democrac ... ffs-canada
Re: Tariffs?
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:15 pm
by GL_Storm
Michael K. wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 6:33 pm
Someone smarter than me is going to have to explain the outrage. I mean, I just found this.
Before President Trump took office, what tariffs did Canada impose on U.S. goods, and what percentages were there on various products exported to the US?
Before January 1st, Canada had tariffs on certain U.S. products, primarily in sectors protected under its supply management system. These included:
Dairy Products: Tariffs ranged from 200% to 300% on items like milk, cheese, and butter to protect Canadian dairy farmers.
Poultry and Eggs: Similar high tariffs were applied to chicken, turkey, and eggs.
Grain Products: Some grains faced tariffs, though these were generally lower than those on dairy and poultry.
So, Canada charges the shit out of us, 200 to 300%....but we are the devil now that we are going to add tariffs? What am I missing here?
https://thefulcrum.us/business-democrac ... ffs-canada
The tariffs that Canada imposes on Dairy, Eggs, Chicken, etc. aren't really the issue in this fight. They're being brought up now because things are escalating, but these tariffs by Canada are relatively unimportant.
Re: Tariffs?
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:34 pm
by Michael K.
GL_Storm wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:15 pm
The tariffs that Canada imposes on Dairy, Eggs, Chicken, etc. aren't really the issue in this fight. They're being brought up now because things are escalating, but these tariffs by Canada are relatively unimportant.
So, the fact that they have always charged us large tariffs as I stated above doesn't matter. It only matters because the US wants to now charge them? Convenient.
Re: Tariffs?
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:40 pm
by gil
Michael K. wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:34 pm
GL_Storm wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:15 pm
The tariffs that Canada imposes on Dairy, Eggs, Chicken, etc. aren't really the issue in this fight. They're being brought up now because things are escalating, but these tariffs by Canada are relatively unimportant.
So, the fact that they have always charged us large tariffs as I stated above doesn't matter. It only matters because the US wants to now charge them? Convenient.
Actually, I am pretty sure that these Canadian tariffs on dairy, etc., only kick in after a certain annual level of imports. That is, there has been zero tariff up to that level. And that annual level has never been reached; hence, Canadian importers and consumers have never had to pay those tariffs. (This all follows the Trump agreement with Mexico and Canada that replaced NAFTA.)
Re: Tariffs?
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:59 pm
by XpertDBA
gil wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:40 pm
Michael K. wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:34 pm
GL_Storm wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:15 pm
The tariffs that Canada imposes on Dairy, Eggs, Chicken, etc. aren't really the issue in this fight. They're being brought up now because things are escalating, but these tariffs by Canada are relatively unimportant.
So, the fact that they have always charged us large tariffs as I stated above doesn't matter. It only matters because the US wants to now charge them? Convenient.
Actually, I am pretty sure that these Canadian tariffs on dairy, etc., only kick in after a certain annual level of imports. That is, there has been zero tariff up to that level. And that annual level has never been reached; hence, Canadian importers and consumers have never had to pay those tariffs. (This all follows the Trump agreement with Mexico and Canada that replaced NAFTA.)
I didn't really believe this last point of yours, so I asked AI myself about it and it says, "The Bottom Line: While some U.S. daily can enter tariff-free, the system is restrictive and VERY LITTLE U.S. dairy actually makes it in without tariffs. The argument that "tariffs never apply because we never hit the quota" is misleading--the structure of the quota itself is part of the barrier"
Re: Tariffs?
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 8:18 pm
by GL_Storm
Michael K. wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:34 pm
GL_Storm wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:15 pm
The tariffs that Canada imposes on Dairy, Eggs, Chicken, etc. aren't really the issue in this fight. They're being brought up now because things are escalating, but these tariffs by Canada are relatively unimportant.
So, the fact that they have always charged us large tariffs as I stated above doesn't matter. It only matters because the US wants to now charge them? Convenient.
If you're talking about reciprocal tariffs, I don't think it actually matters all that much since they're limited in scope. What matters is the 25% across the board tariffs on everything.
Re: Tariffs?
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 8:38 pm
by bpj
Despite all the groaning about what tariffs will do to prices, things don't look bad so far. It's something I actually believe Trump understands a lot more than most of the bozos in our government do.
I guess we'll see in the end. But I did hear Trump is thinking of ending income taxes and relying solely on tariffs to fund government. Seems cool, especially if prices of goods still go down.
Re: Tariffs?
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 10:59 pm
by gil
XpertDBA wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:59 pm
gil wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:40 pm
Michael K. wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:34 pm
So, the fact that they have always charged us large tariffs as I stated above doesn't matter. It only matters because the US wants to now charge them? Convenient.
Actually, I am pretty sure that these Canadian tariffs on dairy, etc., only kick in after a certain annual level of imports. That is, there has been zero tariff up to that level. And that annual level has never been reached; hence, Canadian importers and consumers have never had to pay those tariffs. (This all follows the Trump agreement with Mexico and Canada that replaced NAFTA.)
I didn't really believe this last point of yours, so I asked AI myself about it and it says, "The Bottom Line: While some U.S. daily can enter tariff-free, the system is restrictive and VERY LITTLE U.S. dairy actually makes it in without tariffs. The argument that "tariffs never apply because we never hit the quota" is misleading--the structure of the quota itself is part of the barrier"
I'd ask AI whether there is any evidence that it has worked this way. But yes, I see your point. Certainly possible.
Re: Tariffs?
Posted: Thu Mar 13, 2025 2:16 am
by Donn Beach
Michael K. wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 6:33 pm
Someone smarter than me is going to have to explain the outrage. I mean, I just found this.
Before President Trump took office, what tariffs did Canada impose on U.S. goods, and what percentages were there on various products exported to the US?
Before January 1st, Canada had tariffs on certain U.S. products, primarily in sectors protected under its supply management system. These included:
Dairy Products: Tariffs ranged from 200% to 300% on items like milk, cheese, and butter to protect Canadian dairy farmers.
Poultry and Eggs: Similar high tariffs were applied to chicken, turkey, and eggs.
Grain Products: Some grains faced tariffs, though these were generally lower than those on dairy and poultry.
So, Canada charges the shit out of us, 200 to 300%....but we are the devil now that we are going to add tariffs? What am I missing here?
https://thefulcrum.us/business-democrac ... ffs-canada
This is in fact the point I think people miss, Canada isn't charging the shit out of us with their tariffs, they are charging the shit out of Canadians. They are the ones paying the tariff, not Americans. It's trump that is charging the shit out of you by imposing tariffs. A tariff is a tax applied to buying from a foreign source. Canada's tariffs make things more expensive for Canadians, trump's tariffs make things more expensive for Americans.
An example would be here in the Philippines. They grow sugar cane here, there's a sugar industry. You would think that make sugar cheap but it's not, it's incredibly expensive. That's because of the stiff tariffs imposed to protect it from foreign competition, it's become inefficient but they aren't willing to let it die. That's the thing, tariffs don't make sense. They are used basically to try and halt natural selection. Instead of allowing an industry to be replaced by a better more efficient one. Tariffs shrink the economy and raises prices for consumers. It's basically politics interfering with having an efficient economy.
Re: Tariffs?
Posted: Thu Mar 13, 2025 3:14 am
by bpj
Donn Beach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 13, 2025 2:16 am
Michael K. wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 6:33 pm
Someone smarter than me is going to have to explain the outrage. I mean, I just found this.
Before President Trump took office, what tariffs did Canada impose on U.S. goods, and what percentages were there on various products exported to the US?
Before January 1st, Canada had tariffs on certain U.S. products, primarily in sectors protected under its supply management system. These included:
Dairy Products: Tariffs ranged from 200% to 300% on items like milk, cheese, and butter to protect Canadian dairy farmers.
Poultry and Eggs: Similar high tariffs were applied to chicken, turkey, and eggs.
Grain Products: Some grains faced tariffs, though these were generally lower than those on dairy and poultry.
So, Canada charges the shit out of us, 200 to 300%....but we are the devil now that we are going to add tariffs? What am I missing here?
https://thefulcrum.us/business-democrac ... ffs-canada
This is in fact the point I think people miss, Canada isn't charging the shit out of us with their tariffs, they are charging the shit out of Canadians. They are the ones paying the tariff, not Americans. It's trump that is charging the shit out of you by imposing tariffs. A tariff is a tax applied to buying from a foreign source. Canada's tariffs make things more expensive for Canadians, trump's tariffs make things more expensive for Americans.
An example would be here in the Philippines. They grow sugar cane here, there's a sugar industry. You would think that make sugar cheap but it's not, it's incredibly expensive. That's because of the stiff tariffs imposed to protect it from foreign competition, it's become inefficient but they aren't willing to let it die. That's the thing, tariffs don't make sense. They are used basically to try and halt natural selection. Instead of allowing an industry to be replaced by a better more efficient one. Tariffs shrink the economy and raises prices for consumers. It's basically politics interfering with having an efficient economy.
So if Trump put mirror tariffs on the Phillipines would it hurt the US more or the Phillipines? They'd probably just drop their tariff eventually right?
Seems like without doing what Trump is doing that's the problem. If country's want free trade with the US, they can have it.
If they want to impose tariffs on our goods, we'll charge their goods.
And eventually, we win.
Either by getting more domestically produced products (not sugar, I know), or getting them from places that choose to have free trade with us.
We don't need the Phillipines. We don't need Canada. We don't need Mexico. But they all need us.