2/5* Game Thread Woo v Leiter

[Seattle or Bust]

Thought bpj has demonstrated how the quality of the pitching has been overstated

Might be “overstated” but again you’re arguing C when I’m arguing B.

I’m saying nobody with a brain and eyes would say the M’s offense has been better than the M’s pitching the last 3 years.

[Donn Beach]

The point of statistical analysis such as this is to dig deeper than what you believe you're seeing. Saying wRC+ doesn't pass the eye test seems to me to be missing the point. One should use analytics to test believes not just reinforce ones we have already embraced

[harmony]

The Mariner hitting woes had been overblown the past few seasons.

This past offseason an astute observer grew tired of posting at multiple forums that "last season the Mariners posted a wRC+ of 104, including a league-leading wRC+ of 118 after August 15":

https://www.google.com/search?q=wRC%2B+ ... s-wiz-serp

https://www.google.com/search?q=wRC%2B+ ... s-wiz-serp

The park- and league-adjusted OPS+ and ERA+ the past three seasons (with AL rank):

2024: OPS+ 103 (5th), ERA+ 106 (7th)
2023: OPS+ 108 (4th), ERA+ 106 (7th)
2022: OPS+ 106 (4th), ERA+ 104 (6th)

How did that relate to runs scored
t

Last year the Mariners finished 10th in the American League in runs scored:

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders/major ... &pagenum=1

... but led the league in runs scored after August 15:

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders/major ... 2024-11-01

[harmony]

Seattle general manager Justin Hollander may have hit the nail on the head at Spring Training when he said "we have probably a more balanced team than we've given credit for":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoPWDFawr2w

... at about 13:00.

[harmony]

One could question whether park- and league-adjusted OPS+ and wRC+ have overadjusted this season but the Mariners currently rank second in the league (behind only the Yankees) in runs per game and wRC+:

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders/major ... &pagenum=1

[AZOldDawg]

I just think we are striking out less, putting more balls in play and taking advantage of the law of averages.

[harmony]

I just think we are striking out less, putting more balls in play and taking advantage of the law of averages.

Seattle PBO Jerry Dipoto agrees in this MLB Network interview:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THecs5zZ-nU

[Seattle or Bust]

The point of statistical analysis such as this is to dig deeper than what you believe you're seeing. Saying wRC+ doesn't pass the eye test seems to me to be missing the point. One should use analytics to test believes not just reinforce ones we have already embraced

I firmly believe park adjusted stats give far too much credence to T-Mobile as repressive to offense.

Coors mythically has fallen to 8. T-Mobile has mythically raised to 22… hmmm… could it be that one team has the worst offense in the league while the other is off to a fantastic start?

I think to some level park factors have adjusted to the M’s generally having superior pitching and piss poor offenses.

[bpj]

Thought bpj has demonstrated how the quality of the pitching has been overstated

Might be “overstated” but again you’re arguing C when I’m arguing B.

I’m saying nobody with a brain and eyes would say the M’s offense has been better than the M’s pitching the last 3 years.

If there's anything I've complained about "most", it's the "park adjusted stats" and all of the flaws with them.

It is pretty eye opening how much better they've been since making the coaching changes August 22nd. Whether that's that DeHart sucked bag, or just that Edgar and the new guys are that awesome, I don't know.

But if there's one thing I do (feel that I) know, it's that park adjusted stats suck giant donkey nuts.

[Seattle or Bust]

Thought bpj has demonstrated how the quality of the pitching has been overstated

Might be “overstated” but again you’re arguing C when I’m arguing B.

I’m saying nobody with a brain and eyes would say the M’s offense has been better than the M’s pitching the last 3 years.

If there's anything I've complained about "most", it's the "park adjusted stats" and all of the flaws with them.

It is pretty eye opening how much better they've been since making the coaching changes August 22nd. Whether that's that DeHart sucked bag, or just that Edgar and the new guys are that awesome, I don't know.

But if there's one thing I do (feel that I) know, it's that park adjusted stats suck giant donkey nuts.

I will fully admit that T-Mobile suppresses offense. But enough to say that from ‘22-‘24 the offense has been better than the pitching? Or even close? Utter lunacy.