Post Mortem: Hawks v Cards

[D-train]

This all seems like good news. Bradford sucks.

[Sibelius Hindemith]

The bad news is Haynes sucks as badly (currently).

[Pharmabro]

According to these analytics the Seahawks have had the worst O line play in thd league so far this season and it isn't really that close.

https://nfllines.com/nfl-2024-week-12-c ... -rankings/

From what I saw they were 31st in blocking win rate and there were a bunch of clubs with-in 1 or 2 % of the Hawks 57% but the best in the league had a 70% win rate.

They suck, but just in the tier at the bottom. They are not like T-mobile as a completely different letter grade tier vs the 2nd worst hitter's park.

They were ranked 32 X2, 31st, and 27th across the 4 grades.

That was a huge article. I see one of there was a stretch where they started off in the low 20's and then just slowly went to last over the course of several weeks.

Thanks for reading it. Did you find their analysis to be convincing? I haven't read most of it yet, but just looking at the table i was impressed by their effort. It isn't easy finding any in-depth stuff with regard to O line play without having to pay a subscription fee.

It had a lot of information. I have no experience with their data sets, so I don't know how good they are or not. And, we all watch the games. I can see that they can sometimes open running lanes and sometimes there is nothing but penetration. Sometimes they can hold up in pass-pro and sometimes not. I do know our left tackle Charles Cross has an 82.4 PFF grade on the year which should be a pro-bowl consideration about any year. I know Abe Lucas was pretty good 68.5PFF his rookie year but is just back and our #2 RT is also out so we have been running out 3rd and 4th string guys which is basically practice-squad level expectations.

I think as a group they are below average but with an all-pro guy on the left and a decent starter on the right they should be at least average. There is also the element of new "system" to consider. Along with new starters not knowing what the other guys are going to do and expect for and from each other.

I am cautiously optimistic that they have better grades with continued health.

[Pharmabro]

According to most NFL analytics, the average quarterback dropback in the NFL is around 2.4 to 2.5 seconds. This refers to the time between the snap of the ball and when the quarterback releases a pass or is forced out of the pocket.

He held the ball for 4 seconds here:

The back could have helped a lot with a quick little chip. Then leak out for a quick dump-off.

[Pharmabro]

That to me that is irrelevant, the pocket is collapsing as soon as the ball is hiked. He doesn't have a chance to look down field. When you talk about 2-3 seconds to pass. It's 2-3 seconds after the ball is snapped with a stable pocket and the QB scanning his receivers, that's the general window of opportunity. If he tried throwing the ball in this situation he'd have no idea who would be in position to catch it, it been up for grabs. That to me would the classic poor decision that leads to an interception. I rather him just taking the sack

I have no idea how you can watch that vid and come to that conclusion. He steps back not once, not twice but three times. The blocking was shitty but he had at least two chances to throw it away. I find myself yelling throw it multiple times during a single play about a dozen times a game.

TB12 is credited as really pushing that you do not take negative plays (sacks), and you just throw it away and kill em on the next play. I saw Geno take a horrible strip sack that took points off the board with a huge loss and out of field goal range.

[D-train]

That to me that is irrelevant, the pocket is collapsing as soon as the ball is hiked. He doesn't have a chance to look down field. When you talk about 2-3 seconds to pass. It's 2-3 seconds after the ball is snapped with a stable pocket and the QB scanning his receivers, that's the general window of opportunity. If he tried throwing the ball in this situation he'd have no idea who would be in position to catch it, it been up for grabs. That to me would the classic poor decision that leads to an interception. I rather him just taking the sack

I have no idea how you can watch that vid and come to that conclusion. He steps back not once, not twice but three times. The blocking was shitty but he had at least two chances to throw it away. I find myself yelling throw it multiple times during a single play about a dozen times a game.

TB12 is credited as really pushing that you do not take negative plays (sacks), and you just throw it away and kill em on the next play. I saw Geno take a horrible strip sack that took points off the board with a huge loss and out of field goal range.

Exactly. I said right before the snap, just don't take a sack here and sure enough even though he had ample time he took that strip sack, luckily recovered it but still had to punt.

[Sibelius Hindemith]

I doubt any QB in the NFL would prefer to take a sack over throwing the ball away, yet they all get sacked. The point is that a QB has to make a decision when [aware that he's] under pressure whether to try to buy more time or give up on the play, and the issue is with how well they make those decisions. I think it's a fair assertion that Geno would help the offense by throwing the ball away more often (or just chucking it deep if it's 3rd down) when his only other option is to buy more time with his feet. But it's not always an easy decision.

[Donn Beach]

Sometimes it's better to take the sack than trying to throw the ball away, I think that was one of those times. You can't assume it been successful, need to factor in the chances of a turnover. If it was so important for him not to take the sack the line should have made a better attempt at blocking. Can't always expect the QB to pull plays out of his ass to compensate for his teammates ineptness. Particularly with him saddled with the most unbalanced offensive in the league. Geno's is required to win games single-handed. At what point does that impact the decisions he's required to make

[Sibelius Hindemith]

Some line analytics from ESPN...

ESPN Analytics created revolutionary metrics to measure performance in the trenches -- in both the run and pass game -- using player tracking data from NFL Next Gen Stats.

Our pass rush win rate metric tells us how often a pass rusher is able to beat his block within 2.5 seconds. Likewise, our pass block win rate metric conveys the rate linemen can sustain their blocks for 2.5 seconds or longer.

In run stop win rate, a defender can earn a win by doing any of the following: beating his blocker so he's in better position to stop the runner; disrupting the pocket or running lane by pushing his blocker backward; containing the runner such that he must adjust his running lane; or recording a tackle within 3 yards of the line of scrimmage. If a defender earns a run stop win, his blocker earns a loss -- and vice versa.

Screenshot_20241129-085133_(1).png (191.14 KiB) Viewed 272 times

BTW the Seahawks rank 29th overall if you add up the pass block and run block win rates. https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/410 ... s-rankings