The Other Mariners Midseason Master Plan

[Seattle or Bust]

I love it but I am just not convinced the Astros are willing to tank yet especially for 2 nothing burger prospects. Who else are you kicking to the curb since you are adding Davis and Walker and only dumping Ref? Thanks.

I think they'll DFA Pereda and perhaps option Hoppe if moving Castillo to the pen. Was really just throwing around what could look like a good overall lineup/club.

I don't think trading Walker means the Astros are tanking. They're likely looking at trying a soft rebuild IMO. Because of Walker's age and money, he's frankly a likely trade candidate at the break for a contender looking for a bat. Regardless of his stats, the contract is still under water and getting back 2x pitching prospects from a top 5 farm in baseball seems like appropriate compensation.

I see Wisdom is on the roster now. He would obviously be gone. Tank isn't the right word. They are only a few games back in the WC and playing a lot better so might still want to go for a playoff spot this season. They will obviously reassess in July.

I think the recent "success" is more luck than anything else. It came from pitchers who have ERA's in the 6's throwing 6-inning shut outs.

There's absolutely no way they think that their current pitching staff, with all the injuries, can keep them in contention. If they're that foolish, that failure of looking at the long-term will only benefits the M's.

If there's an organization that knows this... spending 2003-2018 in the same spot the Astros currently find themselves in... it's the Mariners.

[Donn Beach]

Weren't we having the same Astros discussion two seasons ago?

[Seattle or Bust]

Weren't we having the same Astros discussion two seasons ago?

Yeah, and last year they missed the playoffs.

This year their injuries are worse and they're very likely to miss the playoffs again with a worse record.

This is what happens to teams that prolong the inevitable. They turn mediocre and fluctuate seasons slightly below and above .500.

Pride of hanging on to old World Titles gets you nowhere. See the Giants.

[Big_Maple]

The M's were in a completely different position team wise with Felix than they are with Castillo.

1. They didn't have a glutton of starting pitching with 2x more top 30 prospects in baseball on the horizon.
2. In his final years they were falling out of contention window with an aging roster, not getting into it.
3. Felix was not the 7th best starting pitcher in their organization. They were starting Wade Leblanc, Erasmo Ramirez, and Roenis Elias.

Who on earth has suggested Luis Castillo and top prospects for Alex Bregman? (maybe you're referring to Bil and I corrected that lunacy quickly) Literally every person who has suggested the M's trade Castillo understands the M's would have to eat money and likely attach a prospect to get a reliever or minor piece back. I think it's ludicrous that you believe he doesn't have any sort of trade value. As mentioned, if the M's were to eat a large portion of his contract... which would be more like $35M, not $45M (no team is letting him vest his option in '27)... the M's could eat $15M of that and a team like the Nationals could clearly use a veteran, back end starter.

Trading Bryce Miller given what he's shown thus far in '26 would be organizational suicide. Especially with Logan Gilbert regressing and a free agent after next season. Miller is averaging 97 mph on his fastball... far and away the best in his career. His stuff appears to have taken a massive leap. You don't trade that cheap control.

The notion that a team like the Nationals would gladly accept Luis Castillo simply because we offer to "eat" salary and throw in prospects is pure, unadulterated fantasy that misunderstands how professional front offices value their own capital. Even if we subsidized his salary to make the numbers look palatable, you aren't just offloading a contract; you are essentially paying a premium to burn through your elite prospect pool just to remove a player from your own roster. If a team truly believes they need a veteran starter to fill a backend rotation spot, they aren't going to look at the Mariners' aging, expensive liability as their first choice. They’d rather look for a free agent with no strings attached or an elite arm from a non-competitive team with 2 months left on their contract. Paying millions to send your own talent to another team while simultaneously emptying your farm system isn't a "plan," - it just doesn't make any sense.

Furthermore, relegating him to the bullpen proposal fails to consider how service time and veteran rights function in the league. With over five years of service time, Castillo isn't a rookie you can just demote to the bullpen or the minors whenever you please; he has specific protections under the Collective Bargaining Agreement. He can flat-out refuse an optional assignment, and he certainly isn't going to spend his prime years acting as a "long reliever" chaperone. Forcing a high-salary, high-tenure veteran into a role that diminishes his value and status is a recipe for locker room toxicity, not a tactical masterstroke.

As for Bryce Miller, the obsession with his long-term viability isn't just pessimism; it's a prudent acknowledgment of his medical reality. Bone spurs in the elbow are a persistent, degenerative issue, not a one-time "oops" injury; they have a notorious tendency to return, and each subsequent episode increases the risk of structural damage or lost performance. While his current 97 mph fastball is undeniably impressive, you are essentially gambling the team's rotation stability on an arm that has already demonstrated it struggles to stay clean. Trading him while his trade value is at an all-time high, precisely because of these looming health concerns, isn't "organizational suicide". It's the only way to potentially avoid a complete collapse of the rotation if those spurs inevitably flare up again.

[Big_Maple]

Same comment. If you want to trade Miller fine but please come up with a trade that makes sense otherwise it is pointless drivel.

I already came up with my plan. See another thread.

My point is simply if we are going to trade from a starting rotation, then Miller is the one that other teams would be interested in, that would net some decent return, and would free up the log jam in our starting rotation. Assuming other teams are distracted by his 97 mph fastball (a fungible skill, to be sure) and overlook or willingly accept the risk of bone spurs in an elbow, then maybe he's the odd man out.

To wave your hand and glibly claim this as "pointless drivel" is intellectually lazy, and feels kind of troll-y.

[Seattle or Bust]

Same comment. If you want to trade Miller fine but please come up with a trade that makes sense otherwise it is pointless drivel.

I already came up with my plan. See another thread.

My point is simply if we are going to trade from a starting rotation, then Miller is the one that other teams would be interested in, that would net some decent return, and would free up the log jam in our starting rotation. Assuming other teams are distracted by his 97 mph fastball (a fungible skill, to be sure) and overlook or willingly accept the risk of bone spurs in an elbow, then maybe he's the odd man out.

To wave your hand and glibly claim this as "pointless drivel" is intellectually lazy, and feels kind of troll-y.

Your plan was to move Hancock, who has the potential to actually be your no. 2 given how he's going, to the bullpen in favor of a veteran with an ERA in the 6's.

That isn't a plan any winning team should consider.

Also, you suggested the M's trade Miller in this thread. Put a trade together then and justify the trade.

And re: Castillo - veteran arms with contracts attached to them get moved all of the time. Nobody is saying "burn through your prospect capital." They are saying, attach a singular prospect with him to get him moved to a team that could use a starter. If you believe Castillo should have the chance to stick in the rotation b/c he can turn it around, then surely other teams do too.

If trading him can't happen and Castillo wants to bitch and whine about a bullpen assignment, maybe he should have thought about that before he decided to lose his command and pitch to an ERA in the 6's with stud starters around him. I don't give a flying fuck if he's a veteran or not. He can rot on the bench or get DFA'd if he wants to continue to pitch poorly.

Anything else = losses the M's can't afford.

[Big_Maple]

Your plan was to move Hancock, who has the potential to actually be your no. 2 given how he's going, to the bullpen in favor of a veteran with an ERA in the 6's.

Actually, I was in favor of a 5+1 with Hancock being the +1. As I said, "More importantly, it creates a true meritocracy: if any member of the primary five struggles or shows fatigue, the bridge arm is ready to step in without the inefficiency of a rigid six-man rotation that leaves the bullpen short-handed ".

Also, you suggested the M's trade Miller in this thread. Put a trade together then and justify the trade.

This statement was in support of GL_Storm who simply said "I think the move could be Bryce Miller, with the idea of bringing back a pretty significant piece. I don't know what that piece is but I think if you're willing to make that move it probably opens up a lot of possibilities." I am voicing my support for the idea that if we trade from the starting rotation, Miller should be the piece. I have justified this, ad nauseum.

And re: Castillo - veteran arms with contracts attached to them get moved all of the time. Nobody is saying "burn through your prospect capital." They are saying, attach a singular prospect with him to get him moved to a team that could use a starter. If you believe Castillo should have the chance to stick in the rotation b/c he can turn it around, then surely other teams do too.

That's an oversimplification of what I have said. Did you skim my last post? "If a team truly believes they need a veteran starter to fill a backend rotation spot, they aren't going to look at the Mariners' aging, expensive liability as their first choice. They’d rather look for a free agent with no strings attached or an elite arm from a non-competitive team with 2 months left on their contract. Paying millions to send your own talent to another team while simultaneously emptying your farm system isn't a "plan," - it just doesn't make any sense. "

I don't give a flying fuck if he's a veteran or not. He can rot on the bench or get DFA'd if he wants to continue to pitch poorly.

I know you don't give a flying fuck, but management does. They aren't going to let a $45M asset rot on the bench. He can't be DFA'd because of service time. How you feel personally about Castillo has zero to do with what the team actually can and will do with him.

[DavidGee24]

Same comment. If you want to trade Miller fine but please come up with a trade that makes sense otherwise it is pointless drivel.

Plus the Mariners are going to have no choice but to do something with Castillo at some point.

Kade Anderson is not going to spend '27 rotting in the minors.

And they STILL are going to have the same "problem" rolling into next year 5 pitchers set in the rotation.

McGraw is 25.5 yo and pitching in the ACL right now. Not even a prospect imo. Morales is washing out in AA. Just need something better to pique their interest.

Gotta love fan trades. "Say, will you give us your borderline all-star player for these two guys we've got in the minors who probably won't ever even make it to The Show? And if we're asking too much, we'll throw in Connor Joe and a bag of dogshit".

[Michael K.]

Gotta love fan trades. "Say, will you give us your borderline all-star player for these two guys we've got in the minors who probably won't ever even make it to The Show? And if we're asking too much, we'll throw in Connor Joe and a bag of dogshit".

It's almost as good as listening to the guys on the radio that get paid for this shit. Yesterday Wyman and Bob were going on and on about how this team compares to last year's, and talking about how it is very similar at this point. Then naming all the crap players we had last year. How is that a good thing? Unless they believe we plan on adding two impact bats like Naylor and Suarez to this team, how is it a good thing that this team is just as shitty at the end of May as last year's team?

Mentioned that Cal had 9 HRs last year and 7 this year. Yep, and he didn't have to come back from an injury.

Isn't Joe and Refsnyder basically Telez and Donny Barrels? Doesn't take much for 2nd to be better than Bliss, but Young has certainly cooled off. Polanco was a better DH, right?

I just don't get the optimism. Being shitty again this year, after being two innings from the World Series is not a good thing!

[GL_Storm]

I think the move could be Bryce Miller, with the idea of bringing back a pretty significant piece. I don't know what that piece is but I think if you're willing to make that move it probably opens up a lot of possibilities.

Why though? Why would you trade a young pitcher with 3.5 years of cheap control who seems to have hit his stride with his stuff?



The kid is averaging 97 mph on his fastball and hitters look super uncomfortable in the box against him.

I mean, all this in favor of making Luis Castillo happy? A now, no. 7 starter in your organization? Get rid of him or move him to the pen.

It's definitely counterintuitive and for a front office, you have to be prepared for the entire baseball world to turn and look at you like you're riding on the short bus. If it happens, I think it comes about because the piggyback situation becomes intolerable, and if you can't move Castillo then you look at who you CAN trade and what you can get for him.